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[SBMongoos]

Has anyone found the facts on the differences here.  Here's what I got from tier 2 at DLink myself:

They state the only difference is in the f/w and nothing else. That rev a (f/w 1.x) and rev b (f/w 2.x) are identical physically except for the f/w and that there are fixes in f/w for rev b. Nothing else.

At DSL Reports (http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r22709513-DIR825-Rev-B1-anyone-know-whats-changed#22833165):

The B1 revision uses the newer third generation XSPAN 9002 series chipset. In particular it uses the 9220/9223 Atheros 2t2r radios. It also exchanges the A1 Ubicom CPU for an Atheros 7161 CPU. The B1 design appears to model the Atheros reference design very closely. The B1 firmware appears to be Linux based and source can be downloaded from ftp.dlink.de. Maybe we will see open source firmware coming to the B1 revision???

[claykin]

I wrote that on DSLREPORTS.  Yes, the Rev B uses the latest chipset from Atheros.  The Rev A uses the previous generation.  Probably a bigger difference is the switch from Ubicom to Atheros for the CPU and the firmware being Linux based.

I got my information simply by reviewing the internal photos on the FCC OET site, and by downloading and reading some of the files for the firmware source code that is available on ftp.dlink.de.

Any other questions?

Tier 2 at Dlink needs to stop giving out incorrect info.

[SBMongoos]

No one at DLink has the answer other than it's a f/w change.  I have the option to get swapped out from a Rev A to Rev B.  Based on what I have read about the Atheros chipset (9220/9223 Atheros) and CPU (Atheros 7161) it seems it would be worthwhile.   I know both Revs are having some issues with f/w based on what I'm reading here at D-Link forums.  Not sure how widespread that is however.

Would you make the switch from A to B?  I'm happy to move forward with this but feel I need some kind of proof before moving forward so I don't go through this whole process only to find out that A and B are basically the same device through and through.  How did you find this information at the OET site. No idea where to start and/or how to search.  Also, if they are using Atheros in Rev B is it in USA or elsewhere?  I tried the FTP link and dug down to the DIR-825 and the docs I found are in German.

Here's the comment from DSL Reports by Tipster that has me very curious:

Wow are you sure that the main chip network processor is 7161. MAN you got under the hood: Atheros 7161 680MHz (works at 800MHz) That's pretty fast... for home wireless router. The 680MHz Atheros MIPs 24K CPU, that can be overclocked to 800MHz, with a 64KB/32KB instruction/data cache is probably the fastest CPU used in low cost wireless access points.

I wonder if you have 16, 32, 64 or 128MB of RAM?

[Kanati]

Here is the link for the details on the A1 version:
(freq 2412 - 2462 & 5745 - 5825) - https://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/oetcf/eas/reports/ViewExhibitReport.cfm?mode=Exhibits&RequestTimeout=500&calledFromFrame=N&application_id=205150&fcc_id='KA2DIR825A1'

(freq 5180 - 5240) - https://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/oetcf/eas/reports/ViewExhibitReport.cfm?mode=Exhibits&RequestTimeout=500&calledFromFrame=N&application_id=148479&fcc_id='KA2DIR825A1'

And here is the B1:
(freq 2412 - 2462 & 5745 - 5825) - https://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/oetcf/eas/reports/ViewExhibitReport.cfm?mode=Exhibits&RequestTimeout=500&calledFromFrame=N&application_id=215345&fcc_id='KA2DIR825B1'

(freq 5180 - 5240) - https://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/oetcf/eas/reports/ViewExhibitReport.cfm?mode=Exhibits&RequestTimeout=500&calledFromFrame=N&application_id=882165&fcc_id='KA2DIR825B1'

Other links to info:
http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/content/view/30568/100/

http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/content/view/30588/96/

http://broadbandreports.net/forum/r22706303-DIR825-B1-WAN-connection-issues-New-firmware-fixes-it

[SBMongoos]

According to this link (http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/content/view/30588/96/) the B1 (rev b) is still using the Ubicom CPU not the Atheros. Unless I've misread.

"The 825 uses the same basic design that first appeared in the DGL-4500, i.e. Ubicom CPU, two mini-PCI board Atheros XSPAN radios and a four port gigabit switch. In fact, if you look at the larger version of Figure 1, you can see labeling in the lower left corner for the DIR-855, DIR-655, DIR-660 and DGL-4500. Note the heatsink on the gigabit switch and thermal pad on the Ubicom processor."

If this is the case then it doesn't sound like there is too much different between rev a and rev b. Correct me if I'm wrong.

In short does anyone recommend going from rev A to rev B if they have the option to do so?

Thanks!

[claykin]

According to this link (http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/content/view/30588/96/) the B1 (rev b) is still using the Ubicom CPU not the Atheros. Unless I've misread.

"The 825 uses the same basic design that first appeared in the DGL-4500, i.e. Ubicom CPU, two mini-PCI board Atheros XSPAN radios and a four port gigabit switch. In fact, if you look at the larger version of Figure 1, you can see labeling in the lower left corner for the DIR-855, DIR-655, DIR-660 and DGL-4500. Note the heatsink on the gigabit switch and thermal pad on the Ubicom processor."

If this is the case then it doesn't sound like there is too much different between rev a and rev b. Correct me if I'm wrong.

In short does anyone recommend going from rev A to rev B if they have the option to do so?

Thanks!

Please look at the date of that review on SNB.   The review was for the A1 version.  Read carefully, when Tim makes reference to Rev B stuff He's talking about other devices such as the clients he used in his test.  SNB has NEVER tested the DIR-825 B1.  I'm trying to encourage Tim to test it, but so far he's not really interested.  He plans to test the new Netgear WNDR3700 soon which appears to be based on the same chip design as the DIR-825 B1.

Download the B1 sourcecode at the below link, unpack it (it takes a while) and look through the directories.  You'll find doc files that talk about the Fedora linux used to develop the firmware as well as directories labeled AR7161.

ftp://ftp.dlink.de/dir/dir-825/driver_software/

Now, who is the culprit who gave me negative karma?

[SBMongoos]

Doesn't look like rev A.  Says "D-Link DIR-825 Xtreme N Dual Band Gigabit Router: Second Time's the Charm? " and it has the newer case.  I have rev A which has the white horizontal bar over the lights like in this pic: http://www.dlink.com/products/?pid=681. So this is confusing.

Also, given the opportunity would you swap out Rev A for Rev B Claykin?

Interesting to that a lot of this is in German.  I'm told their engineering dept is in Taiwan.

[Kanati]

Dude, if you read the very first paragraph of the article "D-Link DIR-825 Xtreme N Dual Band Gigabit Router: Second Time's the Charm? "...they are referring to the 855 not being very good out of box and DLink trying again with the new 825 (A1).  When DLink first came out with the 825 it was the A1 hardware version.

A1 means first hardware version.  B1 means second hardware version.  This is a change in physical components or parts within the unit.

When a company writes new firmware, it is to change something through software not hardware.

DLink is wrong when they tell you the changes to the 825A1 and 825B1 are firmware only.  No one can tell the FCC that they are changing hardware details (thus Hardware Version A1 to B1) and only make changes in software.  Sounds like you are talking to people that have no idea of what they are talking about.

If I had the A1 (and the plethora of issues that came with it), I would definately try to get it swapped out for the B1.  If you READ the FCC links provided, you will see that the B1 is constructed with better hardware components.

Not to give too much offense...but I think the confusion you are having is of your own doing...you must READ...not skim information provided.

[SBMongoos]

Kanati,

I realize this.  I've done beta testing in the past.  The photo of the unit in the picture looks like the DIR-825 Rev B. So it's confusing.  It even says DIR-825 on the unit.  Rev A1 has a white horizontal bar going across the front.

I understand that a Rev change points to hardware changes but D-Link swears up and down this did not happen.  So, I'm just giving them the benefit of the doubt since they manufactured it.  I know it may not make sense.

I wasn't skimming but have been very doubtful of what Rev B brings.  This is the first time in all the time I've been trying to find out about Rev B and what it brings.  You may be right that the confusion is of my own but D-Link is very diligent about their remarks which I thought was odd and is why I'm here researching further.

[Kanati]

Okay.

Just comparing internal pictures of the A1 and B1 at the FCC...I see:

The A1 has two Radio Cards:
#1 has chips Atheros AR9160 & Atheros AR9106
#2 has chips Atheros AR9160 & Atheros AR9103

The B1 has radios on the main board with:
#1 chip Atheros AR9220
#2 chip Atheros AR9223

Looks like a HARDWARE change to me.  Now, we could go to Atheros and research the chips...

[mactalla]

I understand that a Rev change points to hardware changes but D-Link swears up and down this did not happen.  So, I'm just giving them the benefit of the doubt since they manufactured it.  I know it may not make sense.

A few things to consider:

A1 came with a Ubicom CPU.  For this reason alone we would never see open source firmware for the router as the Ubicom CPU is not supported in Linux [1].
B1 comes with Linux-based firmware.  A statement regarding the GPL was right on top of the router when I unpacked mine yesterday.

How can this be possible if no hardware was changed?

Now consider a typical consumer's perspective, or a support person dealing with most consumers.  To them it still has 1xWAN 4xLAN 2xAntenna 1xUSB, LAN is gigabit, wireless is abgn, same form factor, mounting options, etc, etc.  To them the hardware ( == visible hardware) is no different.

As for me, I deliberately would not purchase one until I found a B1 in store for the sole reason of wanting 3rd party firmware eventually (not yet avail, but A1 will never have it available).  IPv6 support is a bonus.

[1] http://www.dd-wrt.com/wiki/index.php/Known_incompatible_devices

[Kanati]

I drove around the city for half a day and burned a half a tank of gas in my gas guzzling pickup to find the B1 last week.  You couldn't GIVE ME the A1...its just a door stop or boat anchor to me...lol.  It was worth the extra time and money.  I don't regret the buy at all.  Just a few minor firmware issues is all...nothing that will stop production (so to speak).

Here is good info on the A1 radios:  http://www.atheros.com/pt/bulletins/AR9001AP-3NX2Bulletin.pdf

and B1 radios: http://www.atheros.com/pt/bulletins/AR9002AP-4XHGBulletin.pdf

[SBMongoos]

Mactilla/Kanati:

Thanks for your input.  I appreciate it.  It's not uncommon for a company to share details with their support team either.  This is why I'm so disappointed in the lack of information from D-Link support.  At least their Tier 2 or 3 should have this answer and they do not.

So it clearly sounds as though Rev B is the way to go and I'll move forward with it today.  I've been pleased with Atheros in the past.

Some questions:

• Also, apparently when 3rd party f/w will be able to OC this thing to the 800Mhz? 
• By the way it's clear that some in this thread have Rev B (B1).  Has anyone cracked it open to look inside?
• Which f/w to use with the B1?
• Are there any settings in the f/w for B1 that are recommending to be turned off for better performance?  I was reading such things for A1 f/w.

[Kanati]

At this time I am running f/w 2.02NA.  The only issues I am having are listed here: http://forums.dlink.com/index.php?topic=7154.0

As far as performance goes, I haven't really entered that realm.  Just been looking at functionality for the past week.  Biggest performance thing for me is setting the MTU, in the router.  Some people do and some people don't...those that don't wonder why their connection is slow.

The other thing would be the Uplink Speed in the QOS engine.  The automatic setting works okay, but that measurement isn't exact (line speed and testing results vary constantly) and the measurement changes every time you reboot...so I set it manually using DSLReport's tweak tester and various speed tests.  Find the sweet spot where download and upload are at their very max.  There are some listed speeds you can choose from but like a friend of mine, he has a download speed of 4Mbps and the list in the QOS engine doesn't go that high so he types in a speed that works for his connection.

There are a lot of people here that know far more than I on this subject, so I'll let them chime in...hope these couple of things get you started.  There is also a huge amount of information on this subject at DSLReports.com...see the FAQs section.

[SBMongoos]

Why not disable the Uplink Speed in the QOS Engine?  You can uncheck the "Enable Traffic Shaping"
(Enable Traffic Shaping =  When this option is enabled, the router restricts the flow of outbound traffic so as not to exceed the WAN uplink bandwidth.)  Just uncheck it and you see the "Automatic Uplink Speed" becomes grayed out.

I've made a few changes that were recommended for the Rev A and they seem to be working. 

I've also learned, however, whenever I get a bigger update for Firefox I run into speed issues with the browser that have made me thing there were router issues.  Speed and connectivity.  I have, at least twice, uninstalled FF and reinstalled FF to see these problems clear up. So my impression has been that FF gets mucked up some times after bigger updates.  Say 3.0 to 3.5 for example.  I have a few browser installed for web work and this is how I discovered his issue.

Also, what MTU setting are you using? I have mine set to 1492.